I dagens episode har vi gleden av å ha med oss Eric Larssen Amaral Rohter, Brand Designer og Strategist, og medgrunnlegger av Larssen Amaral. I dagens samtale dykker vi ned i Erics måte å takle overgangen fra USA til Norge på, hans karriere i design og hvordan han og hans firma skiller seg ut i en konkurransedyktig bransje.
Vi snakker om utfordringene og mulighetene ved å drive et eget byrå, mens man også gründer en tech startup (!). Eric deler sine tanker om fremtiden for bransjen, rollen AI vil spille, og gir verdifulle råd til bedriftseiere om hvordan de kan bygge sin merkevare og unngå vanlige fallgruver.
Bli med oss for å høre om Erics kuleste jobbprosjekter, hva som gir ham energi, og hvordan han og hans team tilnærmer seg nye prosjekter for å skape de beste resultatene for deres kunder. Dette er en episode du ikke vil gå glipp av hvis du er interessert i å forstå hva som driver suksess i dagens dynamiske design- og merkevarelandskap.
Dagens episode er produsert av Gründerloftet, regionens mest spennende arbeidsplass for deg som driver din egen bedrift.
Og Vy Strategy: markedsføringsbyrået i haugesund som hjelper kunder å velge deg ved å fokusere på strategi og gode løsninger.
Dagens sponsor er Hagland Finans. Hagland finans er en
I dagens episode har vi gleden av å ha med oss Eric Larssen Amaral Rohter, Brand Designer og Strategist, og medgrunnlegger av Larssen Amaral. I dagens samtale dykker vi ned i Erics måte å takle overgangen fra USA til Norge på, hans karriere i design og hvordan han og hans firma skiller seg ut i en konkurransedyktig bransje.
Vi snakker om utfordringene og mulighetene ved å drive et eget byrå, mens man også gründer en tech startup (!). Eric deler sine tanker om fremtiden for bransjen, rollen AI vil spille, og gir verdifulle råd til bedriftseiere om hvordan de kan bygge sin merkevare og unngå vanlige fallgruver.
Bli med oss for å høre om Erics kuleste jobbprosjekter, hva som gir ham energi, og hvordan han og hans team tilnærmer seg nye prosjekter for å skape de beste resultatene for deres kunder. Dette er en episode du ikke vil gå glipp av hvis du er interessert i å forstå hva som driver suksess i dagens dynamiske design- og merkevarelandskap.
Dagens episode er produsert av Gründerloftet, regionens mest spennende arbeidsplass for deg som driver din egen bedrift.
Og Vy Strategy: markedsføringsbyrået i haugesund som hjelper kunder å velge deg ved å fokusere på strategi og gode løsninger.
Dagens sponsor er Hagland Finans. Hagland finans er en
I dagis episode har vi gleden av å ha med oss Erik Larsen Amiral-Otter, brand designer og medgrundlegger av Larsen Amiral. I samtalen dykkar vi ned I Eriks måte å takle overgangen fra USA til Norge, på hans karriere I design og hvordan han og hans firma skyldes ut I en konkurransedyktig bransje. Vi snakkar om utfordringane og mulighetane ved å drive eit eget byrå and run his own office while also founding a tech startup. Erik shares his thoughts on the future of the industry, the role AI will play, and gives valuable advice to business owners on how they can build their own brand and avoid ordinary fallout. Join us to hear about Erik's coolest job project, what gives him energy and how he and his team are approaching new projects to create the best results for their customers.
Speaker 1:In this episode, you won't miss those who are interested in understanding. Thank you, enten du vil ha hjelp med alt eller kun ha noe enn til å se over. Jeg bruker Hageland selv og har vært veldig fornøyd med fleksibiliteten de gir meg og kombinasjonen av at jeg gjør noe selv, at de gjør de vanskelige tingene og at jeg er partner av en god software og app som fungerer I hverdagen. Okay, welcome to the studio, Erik. Welcome to Lykkesliten, Thank you. Thank you, Good to be here. I don't know how we would translate Lykkesliten in English.
Speaker 3:We were talking about it you know Feeling small. Yes, and it's funny. I thought it was like a play on words, like both about size, but also about like small milestones in your career, but Cecilia shot that one down pretty quick. That sounds good, though there's the branding guy thinking about how to spin the name.
Speaker 1:And somebody has said Lykke. Sliten.
Speaker 2:That works too. Okay, so, and welcome to you too as well, maurice.
Speaker 1:Okay, sorry, nice to meet youris. Nice to meet you.
Speaker 2:Nice to meet you, morris, you've been in san francisco with the crown prince. I have, yeah, how was that? That sounds? Um, no, it was. It was really fun. It was.
Speaker 2:It was, uh, it was a really fast trip or like a lot of traveling for a short amount of time in san francisco, but we were there with the crown prince and a lot, of, a lot of ministers, yeah, and it was a California Norwegian collaboration sort of festival.
Speaker 2:So it's really interesting to see what was going on over there with AI and technology and innovation and how that affects, like, our sort of industries, our biggest industries, like with energy and, yeah, our sustainable future. So it was a really good visit. We visited apple and nvidia and google and all these big companies working with ai over there. And then, of course, it was great to be in a delegation with with, uh, with the crown prince, because that opens a lot of doors, that sure, if they go in yourself what was the most fascinating visit you had or the talk you saw, people you met I think the most fascinating like I was really excited to go finally go visit apple, like the new hq they had, yeah, um, but the most exciting visit was, uh, actually nvidia, which is a company, like huge company now.
Speaker 2:They have 30 000 employees and they're producing all these um, what's it called? At least like the hardware behind a lot of ai and a lot of computers. And there we met their founder and he said, like we're living now in the fifth like industrial revolution, where it's not, it's not about producing power anymore, it's more about producing intelligence. He says that was the wave that we're in now and he said it was really important for norway not just to produce energy, export it to other countries, then use that energy to produce intelligence with, but also that we also set up an infrastructure, infrastructure, data we can produce intelligence yeah, what's interesting is, you know all all of these technologies are, ironically, extremely power consuming, exactly.
Speaker 3:You know these, these supercomputers and and you know to keep things cool and and yeah, you know data processing and servers. I mean it's, it's insane. So it's like a little bit of this kind of evil evil circle there as well.
Speaker 2:But, yeah, that's and that's why you mentioned this, I know way in our like, since we have so much clean energy, we're in a really good position to, yeah, to set up infrastructure to produce intelligence, and it sounds and it was mind-blowing to sort of listen to that like that. This, this fowler was saying like that will be sort of the next, uh, sort of uh, what's it called? Yeah, currency, currency, like that you were able to produce intelligence, which sounds both cool and weird at the same time. Yeah, for sure, I mean, it was a good trip, yeah yeah, and you're from the states eric.
Speaker 1:Where are you from and how did you end up in haugesund?
Speaker 3:yeah, I'm from. I'm from the us. I've got a more complicated story and I usually kind of say how long it's a long story. So do the short version, but maybe today I can, I can give a podcast. It's a long format.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I can give a little bit of my background um, yeah, I'm, I was born in the us but uh, I've lived all over the globe. Um, I grew up the this, the kid of a journalist, and my father was journalist in the new york times for I don't know, uh, at least 20, 25 years, uh, probably more. Uh, before that he wrote for newsweek. He'd done freelance journalism. So you know, natural, natural part of being uh having a family as a journalist is moving around uh, around the world. Um, so you know I was born in the us and we hopped on the plane and went straight to mexico. So I grew up in Mexico City. My sister grew up the first three years of her life in Beijing in the 80s 80s communist China. My parents were posted there for a while. So that kind of sets the tone for the life that I've lived. So you know I've lived in, yeah, grew up in Mexico City, moved to California, moved to Miami. My mother is half Portuguese, half Brazilian. We ended up in Brazil for for a couple of periods in my teenage years. Um, I've lived in.
Speaker 3:I got a job in the design industry they're super competitive design agency uh, which comes with really hard uh working hours. Uh, you know it's cutthroat If you want the project three or four years and and really worked my way up as well, uh, cause we can get into it later. But you know I graduated not. I don't have a degree in design, I have what we in the U S call like a secondary degree, a minor knowledge. But I had the drive and the interest and and aesthetic eye. So I really had to kind of work really hard to kind of get to to the top there. And you know, after four years it was, you know, a little bit of burnout already and nobody wants that in their first job straight out of school. Uh. So that was one one motivator to kind of think about new horizons. But the other one was kind of interest as well, living in in the U S, uh.
Speaker 3:But then I became really interested in European design, uh, it was a totally different aesthetic uh, both branding work but graphic design in general, um. So that kind of opened up uh, a new door for me to think, okay, do I have to stay in the U S? You know, again, with my background I've been used to living, uh moving every three or four years, uh. So I've been in DC for seven or eight and started to feel a little bit restless. So, you know, I started thinking maybe Europe's the next step. Uh, and again part of the long story short, my aunt, uh, is married to a Norwegian Uh, so they've lived in Oslo for 30, 40 years probably, so I've got two Norwegian cousins in Oslo as well. So I said, you know what, I'll move out to Oslo as like a hub while I look for a job in Europe.
Speaker 3:And I got to Oslo in the summer of 2011 and started applying for jobs in the Netherlands, the UK, even like Portugal, spain, france, really all over the place and then started to think about norway like it was just really a place to live and and easier to go to interviews in different european countries. But I started to really enjoy being there, started doing a little bit of freelancing, um, and started applying for jobs, and the interest at that time was really high. Uh, I think design had still been a little bit more of a of a kind of mysterious and kind of less commercialized career path for students. So I felt when applying for jobs, like the market you know was was was desperate. They needed talented designers and I had, you know, four years of experience under my belt, and so I got a lot of job offers. The irony is I was thinking to stay in Oslo and timing of things, I was like running out on my six month visa to be able to. Once you're looking for a job in Norway, your three months extends to six. So I was getting close to that six month and had been applying for jobs in Norway and I got an offer from Antti, which is like one of Norway's biggest design and ad agencies. They were starting up an office in Bergen. Two guys and I would be their first hire. But it came with a lot of interesting perks of okay, you'll be part of the core team. Uh, there was talk about ownership and partnership possibilities. You know, there's something obviously in me now, now, so many years later, I'm definitely like a grunde myself. I want to, you know, want to create things, and not just visual things, but businesses and strategies and opportunities. So I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 3:Never been to Bergen, took a digital interview and I ended up I took, I flew out there for like an interview, but just kind of went to the office and back to the airport and took the job. Had, didn't even like, didn't even check out the city, um, and after I accepted that job. I just started getting all these offers from from agencies in Oslo, um, but you know, I have a big philosophy in my life, like I never regret anything I do, uh, or things that happen in life, whether they're good or bad. I think everything has a purpose, you know. So I never look back on, oh, I wish that I had gotten that first opportunity in Oslo, you know, because I got a big part of the success of my career, I think, was getting that opportunity to be part of a small company in Bergen, help shape things from the ground up, being given a lot of responsibility. I was like 25 when I started that job, probably 25, 26. So I was young but thirsty and ambitious and I think that gave me a lot of opportunities and I think that all of that has a trickle down effect to where I am today.
Speaker 3:That's how I met my partner in life and business partner, cecilia. She was working in Bergen as well at the time and we met actually through colleagues, ironically trying to space, you know, put us together and we were no way nobody's going to set us up and you know I had just gotten there, didn't want to date anybody. She was like no, no, no, american guy, no way. So that started as a friendship and and kind of uh, yeah, developed into into something more over over time and and, uh, you know, we saw that we had a lot of, a lot of the same ambitions and same work ethic.
Speaker 3:Uh, so, you know, I was no-transcript interesting and diverse background. We're both business minded as well as design minded people and we decided, okay, let's, let's do something together instead of doing our own things. Let's, let's pull forces and and make something happen. Um, so that's the long version of how I've ended up here in Hargis. And so you know, after, after that decision in Bergen to do our own thing, we talked about like I didn't even think about the US as the option, cecilia threw it out there we talked about Copenhagen, oslo. You start to weigh things up. You know what is office space cost, what's the competition and the market like, and me being the go-getter globetrotter throughout. What about Hergeson?
Speaker 2:That's funny Copenhagen, oslo, the US and Hergeson.
Speaker 1:And you know, I think we have done the right choice as well, marius, when he says this.
Speaker 2:Yes, for sure, I'm not a thrilled universe.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, no, and you know I've been here a couple times to visit cecilia's family. But what I thought was interesting was it was a little bit untouched. You know, there everybody told us, oh, haggis and such like, uh. So it was like a different market for us to come in as like a design studio specializing especially especially in branding it. It was services that existed here, but everybody was more focused on reklam, synlighet, medieflottet. It was a very different perspective than branding, which is like more of a philosophy, more of like a deep business value and less maybe about buying surfaces to be visible on. So it was a super exciting possibility there. So we have a joke like next step is Utsira, because it just gets smaller and smaller and smaller. But no, so that's now almost eight years ago in June that we started up here in Haugesund and never looked back, and it's been a crazy fun journey.
Speaker 3:Did you get like business from day one? Yeah, it looked back and it's been a crazy fun journey. Did you get like business from day one? Yeah, it was. It was really nice because we had started. We, you know we had like a six month overlap with our old jobs and what was great was we were able to bring Cecilia's old employer on as our first client, which helped pay the bills from day one.
Speaker 3:But I remember, I think it was like the first month we were in our office here in Ferguson, we got an email, uh from the British museum and at first we thought what is this like a spam email, um, but yeah, sure enough, they were reaching out and it was really. It was worded really really funny. You know, oh, you know, we found a project of yours online and we thought it was really interesting and we're looking at at finding an agency to help us, um, extend our family offer. They, they have, like you know, a big tilbud for for families, uh, in the museum you can rent backpacks with all this cool adventure stuff and explore the museum. And so, you know, it's been such a traditional institution they wanted to find a way to how do we reach a new target audience parents, grandparents and kids? Uh, it's like the opposite end of the spectrum from what you think of british museums super traditional, old british tradition, uh, cultural institution it's. It's it's, you know, cold and conservative in in a cultural sense. Um, so suddenly they wanted to really think different.
Speaker 3:So, you know, that was like really our first new client after after bringing money with us and that that was both really exciting and, I think, really helped in hargason, where we were new, to kind of set the bar of of what we do and and the quality that we deliver. You know it's tough. I've heard in harrison it's funny like in harrison people people don't don't take you seriously until you succeed somewhere else. You know they talk about it often with musicians. Like she's on a sinful um I think had has a has a tough relationship um with harrison and and it's funny like I don't necessarily feel that. I think haggerson is a very kind of like hey, you put all uh uh kind of city um. You see this good mix of norwegian it's fantastic.
Speaker 1:Well, you speak very well norwegian. But yeah, what is okay to do this?
Speaker 3:yeah, I thought it would be fun. I never I never do anything, anything in english, so this, this was a nice opportunity but it was in haugesen you founded, like your company today, like last number.
Speaker 2:All that started in haugesen right?
Speaker 3:yeah, for sure I mean, it was started in our living room in in walsona in bergen, um, kind of dreaming up the vision and and you know, the business strategy and business plan and and budgeting and all that stuff. But yeah, the creative work and and producing stuff didn't start until we got here and, yeah, we moved. We moved here in june of 2016, uh, unpacked all the stuff into our apartment that we had bought and then moved to the the moving truck down to our off office on Kaya and unpacked there and next day we were in the desk and working on a deadline already to deliver stuff for a client.
Speaker 2:So yeah, so for people who don't know, lars Namro, what do you do?
Speaker 3:And for all our international listeners, of course. Yeah, lars Namro is, we call ourselves a branding studio, um, and we say branding because you know, our specialty lies definitely in, in design, which someone would maybe call, yeah, graphic design what we do. But our, our specialty is focused around branding. And I think again back to our, our diverse backgrounds that cecilia and I have. We're both in addition to visual and creative people, we're both business people as well. We like strategy, we like to think uh, think different, think disruptive um, connect business and creativity. So over the years we've really honed in our skills on balancing the creative and the strategic um. So you know, in terms of branding and our services, sure, like our end product is a visual identity for a brand, but we do everything from the start strategic work with the brand, brand positioning and doing a brand sprint to kind of define tone of voice, personality, values to naming and tone of voice and communication principles for a brand, and then, you know, resulting in what people see as the visual identity and even, you know, rolling it out in a new launch campaign for brands or rebranding. So that's where our specialty lies. And you know, we've had a diverse portfolio of clients over the last seven, eight years. So we're pretty industry agnostic. We're not working with just mod, a team or just culture. You know we have.
Speaker 3:Like I said, british Museum was one of our first clients. We've rebranded Haugesund Spotted Bank right before the pandemic of our first clients. We've rebranded, uh, ferguson's body bank, uh, right before the pandemic. Um, right now we've got a project rolling out in April, uh, uh, a bit of a brand refresh for a bat against Tidna. So you know we work. We work nationally and internationally, but it's it's really fun to be able to do that from Ferguson, um, you know, just because we sit here and that was a bit of our philosophy when we started our business was no matter where we end up, it's not going to limit us. Geography doesn't have to be a limiting factor and and and a business model, um, so you know we've it's been cool to see that we've been able to to do that from day one.
Speaker 3:Um, I would say, like most of our, most of our business is definitely local or regional. We work a lot with Bergen and Stavanger in the last couple of years, but mostly here in Ergason. But it's exciting, we get a lot of the right clients for us. It's people that both understand and value branding and want to think different, to think different Like we're definitely an agency that you know, if you want the same as as your neighbor or your competitor, we're not the right agency for you, and that goes back to like one of our core values. You know, we believe branding is about standing out and and standing and setting yourself apart instead of just blending in Um. So we've been super lucky to get the right kind of projects and and the right kind of and and the right kind of uh yeah, collaboration partnerships with clients.
Speaker 1:So it's been yeah, it's been really really rewarding and really fun what do you do if your customers come and ask for a campaign, for example? Do you do it yourself, or do you work with a partner, or do you outsource it, or how do you handle this?
Speaker 3:it's tough if it's, if it's an existing client that we've done the branding work for. Um, it's something that we can take because you know in in addition to like our core branding services we have, you know the brand has to live somewhere. So you know our delivery doesn't necessarily stop at the identity. You know that here you go, here's your visual identity. We do a lot of the rollout um for how that identity lives and works out in the world. So you know, if it's the right kind of campaign, especially kind of in that launch of a rebrand or or of a new brand, that's definitely something we take. Uh, but if, if it's not the right fit, yeah, we'll pull in a partner.
Speaker 3:Um, when we did this, this identity work for bad against hedna um know they did a launch campaign uh, or there was both a launch campaign and kind of like a general messaging and and brand positioning campaign that they had planned in. So they kind of tried to to coordinate that Um. You know they contacted us and said, would you guys like to take this? Uh, you know we were in a super busy period at that point and and in terms of uh, the deliverables, it was like a lot of media buying and, and you know, uh, definitely the creative copywriting was something we said we would, we would happy, be happy to be a part of.
Speaker 3:But you know, the other thing is is not where our competence or or passion lies. So we, we let them find a partner in Bergen and we just kind of they used us as a, as a advisor to make sure things were on brand, a little bit of brainstorming on the creative things, uh. So collaboration is always a possibility and we'll, we'll, we'll, definitely pull in partners ourselves, or clients might pull us into a collaboration with one of their partners. Cool.
Speaker 1:Just before I move on to more questions around your business, I want to just dive into to how it was for you to come from the us to norway. I mean, I just asking this because I think it's exciting for us to live, to find out what we could do better or what we do what. What are we good at and when? When taking in talent and people who are have energy and want to come to a region to work, what can we, what can we, how can?
Speaker 3:we improve. Okay, that's interesting. I think I have like a bit of a different perspective because I'm so used to having to assimilate into new cultures. I'm I'm very like language curious. So, like, picking up Norwegian for me went super quick six months I was able to speak it. So I've had a very different experience, but, you know, modest. A couple years back I did a, I did a like keynote for uh, what's that for flow, about kind of, yeah, doing business in norway, yeah, for the flow accelerator program, and I think that was like a good summary. It's like it. It's definitely a different business climate here in terms of of kind of the everyday.
Speaker 3:I think Norwegians and Norwegian culture is very welcoming. It's a very kind of a community focused uh, culture Uh, you know, do not is not a concept that exists in the U S really, um, and that's a big part of Norwegian culture. So there's like a willingness to help and support. But it's also paired with like the more old school stoic stereotype of Scandinavians themselves and and uh, enjoy themselves best maybe in their own company or or in the company of their close family and friends. So I can see, you know if I, if I didn't speak norwegian, I think the threshold to assimilate socially, for example, would be a bit more challenging. Although you guys are amazing at english, um, it's, it's. It's like mind-blowing to see quality of. You know, the quality of English that that Norwegians have. Um, but, uh, but, yeah, I think.
Speaker 3:I think it's been a good experience and I think, um, it's a. It's a thing that changed with culture as well. Uh, you know Norway, their. Your timeline from 1970s to today has been like a exponential acceleration of of. You know what oil has done for the economy and the trickle down of, of developing new and exciting industries. So you know, when I talk with my, my family in Oslo, like about my cousin's childhoods, uh, growing up in the eighties and nineties in norway, you know one or two tv channels and and you know very kind of they say it themselves a much simpler life and and you guys weren't as globally connected. But now today it's like norway is a big player. Yeah, norway's on.
Speaker 3:You know all the top lists of, you know great places to live and work and you know, for me, back to my reason to come to europe, a bit of that burnout like I ironically was searching for a better work life balance, and then I come here and become a super ambitious, self-employ, important, uh, having time for life outside of work and being able to to blend those two as well. So I think you know, I think you guys are doing a great job and there there's always room for improvement. But, um, but yeah, I, I think, uh, the threshold to kind of get started here in Norway is pretty low. And I would say then I would flip it and say the opposite Don't be afraid to learn Norwegian.
Speaker 3:Super easy for expats to come to Norway and speak English. And my biggest tip there is the first time you meet someone, you have an active choice on what language you want that relationship to continue in. If you speak English the first time, it's so hard to flip it over to Norwegian and vice versa. Um, but think about that If you're serious about staying here and living here and creating a career and family here, learn the language. It's it's great for getting to know people and that people can feel comfortable. You know, marius and I speak English with it, with each other, but mainly because you want to. Um, otherwise, the way I practice, yeah, sort of that's like practice for you, um, but when we're together with with other people and other friends. We'll speak norwegian, no problem. Uh, so that's, that's my tip, maybe to to turn it around and yeah and think about that.
Speaker 1:I think I spoke in english to you the first time I met you, but then I met you in the queue at uh at the Wangen festival, the toilet queue and suddenly you spoke in Norwegian. I was like shocked what am I doing? I'm sure, I'm sure.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I'm sure I've screwed with some people's head there as well. Like you know, sometimes I'll be really lazy and if you know, I've got to write an email to like a, like a service provider or somebody that's producing stuff for us. Sometimes I'll just do it in English and then it just continues in English and then I'm like they have no clue that, like I can see they're like they would definitely prefer to answer me in, in, in Norwegian, but you know, I just let it go, it go. I never, never address it. So I'm sure there's a lot of people out there that are a little bit confused.
Speaker 3:Um, I still get it even people I've met before will ask me you suck in norsk. Yeah, yeah. They just have to like remind themselves what did I speak with this guy last time so amazing.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you for that feedback. That's great. I I think I was talking to some some uh, some other people who moved to the region as well. I think we got the same feedback. Back to business a bit. If I'm a business leader, well, I'm a business leader and I want to start working on my brand and I want to do something more. I want to, you know, find a way to express our values. Where should I start? What should I think of?
Speaker 3:Where should you start and what should you think about? It's tough, I mean. Are you thinking like what's the right process, together with a branding partner, for example? Yeah, no, I mean it's tough. I think branding is an investment.
Speaker 1:I'm just asking because I think there's so many managers who haven't really any clue where to start or how to they just the brand just lives on its own way. You know, it just happens because you don't do anything with it.
Speaker 3:But let's then. I've got a couple of different angles here on that, because if we take a step back, like what is branding? Take a step back, like what is branding? Um, you know, I think I think people, often everybody has a little bit of a different interpretation of what branding is and it goes a little bit to like different, different people's focus. You know, if a manager or a business owner is focused on their product or their customer service, that's the brand. Good customer service is the brand. Great quality products is the brand. Yeah, they're all part of the brand.
Speaker 3:Branding is complex. It is how you talk to your customers, how you give them great customer service. It's the amazing unpackaging experience of your product. It's how the identity looks when a user goes into your website. It's the tone of voice you communicate on your website and social media. It's a super complex ecosystem. It's how a space smells when you walk into a store. All of that is your brand.
Speaker 3:And I think that's maybe the most important thing to start with is branding isn't one thing or the other. It's a complex image. So, even though a manager and owner might have a vision or a focus they want to focus on, it's important to think about how you're perceived from the outside, which brings me to my next point. It's like you know, branding is a gut feeling. You can say all you want and try and shape the perception that people have of your product or service or brand, but it's all about what they feel and that's hard to manipulate. Without addressing all of these things. And you know, I like to say, you know, with branding, you either get it or you just don't know that you get it. Because, as consumers, when we go to, like, a grocery store, a lot of the stuff we're buying doesn't just go on the on on price. We're making choices between, uh, this pasta or that pasta, and some people are saying I want a cheap pasta, so they're looking for the product that looks cheap. Others are foodies and want quality products, so they're looking for the product that looks cheap. Others are foodies and want quality products, so they're looking for the packaging that looks expensive. So these are like branding decisions that are made and design decisions that are, you know, subconsciously affecting buying patterns. Um, so it's so important to think about all of that, and which brings me to my my third point, then.
Speaker 3:Branding is definitely an investment. I think people need to look at it not as a cost but as an investment. It it affects, as we've discussed, how consumers uh interact with your brand. But I see like a major value of the branding work we've been doing for the last 10 years is also about recruitment. Hergeson, you know back to like how it is to be a foreigner here. I think one of the biggest challenges I see that now this is a side note biggest challenge is recruiting the right people and getting people to move home to Hergeson. It's not a concept in the us I would move across country from new york to portland, oregon if there was an interesting job, whereas in norway it's very oslo or maybe your hometown, but not really much else. Other though you're, you're an exception, but you're here because of family.
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah, yeah. So that really locks the talent pools geographically. There's not, like you know, spillover, of course, with exception. So back to the branding aspect.
Speaker 3:Here it's been a major part of positioning a company is how does our brand look? How is our brand perceived to potential colleagues? It's not just about how a customer perceives or interacts with your brand, and that can be all from having a cool office space to, yeah, just having an energetic, fun, uh looking brand that communicates and is active on social media, and a website that's modern and slick and looks nice, that you can be proud of to, yeah, like the culture and philosophy in a company. And again, all of that goes back to branding. So I see that's a major tool and that's why we say don't underestimate the value here. And, yeah, it's an investment and requires putting some money into it, but it has such a payback.
Speaker 3:It's not just about sales and marketing, it's also about recruitment. It can be about sustainability and community. So you know, remember that it's a powerful business tool. I think people think marketing is like the only thing, uh, linked to sales, for example, or, or direct sales. But branding is such a uh, an indirect marketing and sales tool that don't underestimate that. That can, that can really generate business and generate, uh, good colleagues and good recruitment these, these are a lot of things.
Speaker 1:So as a manager I'm thinking oh, where do I start? So I guess you have a process. When you get a customer in the door, for sure, what process do you use to get?
Speaker 3:this accelerated, you know, I think, in terms of also figuring out what fits and is right for each customer that we have. You know, we have different kind of services and packages that can be tailored to different customers, but nobody gets a cheaper deal because they're this client or that client, but they might get a simpler delivery, like what's the bare bones and minimum that we need to have if we're on a budget, versus we have a big budget and we want to take it all out, uh, so, you know, in terms of that kind of first onboarding with clients, it's about figuring out where, where their investment lies and how ambitious, um, the project might be. And, you know, once that's kind of out of out of the way, it's much, much smoother sailing For most of our clients. Now I'll speak, you know, generally about everybody we work with. When we start a branding process, it always starts with some meetings and workshops and you know we've kind of cooked our strategic work down into something we call a brand brand sprint, where we, uh, you know, use three to four hours and sit ourselves, you know, sit down with a client and really work through some core, core things. That's all from kind of defining, uh, market positioning, where are we in terms of our competitors? Where do we want to be to, you know, vision and purpose and values? Um, because that becomes, especially when we're going to do naming and and tone of um. Because that becomes, especially when we're going to do naming and and tone of voice for a brand, that becomes a major foundation for for how we communicate what. Who are we, what is our vision, what is our purpose? Um, so, so that brand sprint is kind of core to getting a lot of that strategic stuff on the table. What are our business goals? And that turns into what we call a creative brief. We kind of align business goals with creative execution.
Speaker 3:And you know, for those of us that are, for those of you that know larson and our role, our work is very conceptual. Our branding work. It's very about, like, storytelling, and I think that's one of our unique deliveries or unique aspects of what we do. We don't just make a nice looking logo, we find a story to tell for the brand that can be told through the visuals, that can be told through the copywriting and communication, that is told through the name. So all that strategic work helps us build that story.
Speaker 3:Um, and then and then the rest of the process is a bit, a bit uh agile and tailored to different, different types of clients. Uh, of course, as in any business, a bigger budget allows for more exploration, uh, more involvement, um, you know, more uh, detailed, deep dives, uh, smaller budgets. We have to kind of maybe go with our gut, based on that strategic work and the brand sprint. Then we say, okay, we know where we need to be and that's something we've kind of honed, honed in on over over the years of our careers, like our gut is a really good gut.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we, we, we have a good branding gut. We can hear a story, look at a business model and a strategy, look at a kind of competitor landscape and know where we need to place a client. So we can work pretty, pretty agile there. Um, so I don't know if that, yeah, that helps give perspective, definitely. Um, and I think don't underestimate that strategic part. You know, like I said, it can be as simple as a brand sprint, which is three or four hours. Yeah, it's three or four hours to pay for, but it's so worth it.
Speaker 1:For me, this is exactly what I want to hear. You know, because you have all this end goal where you want to be, and that's a lot of things, because everything piles up to a brand right. But if you can start somewhere concrete with a brand sprint, then you can go from there. You have something you can work from and your processes that you know work. So I think that's what we want to hear, and also, I think there's been so much talk about AI right and advertisement business, communication business, but I think your part of the business is based on a lot of strategic work and creativity, so maybe you're well positioned for the future that you know ai is not coming for your job.
Speaker 3:yeah, no, I'm I'm never afraid of technology or ever thinking it's gonna take. Take my job at least, um, and that's both in terms of what we do, but also me personally, in my interest. I'm like very tech interested, yeah, um, but um, I think ai is super exciting and we use it, you know, like on a daily basis. But I see it's, it's pros and I see its limitations. Um, you know, in terms of creativity, it can do it. Um, you know, when it's about coming up with a creative concept, I've tried, I've used it, I've I've thought, okay, can I, can I actually get an employee out of this, uh, out of chat, gpt, and, and that he can be a really good sparring partner? Yeah, um, or they, not he, um, and I think that's that's maybe the key. Sparring partner is great, um, because you can, you can get some perspective, you can get some ideas of where to start, but ask it to solve something conceptual and creatively, yeah, and you get the cheesiest stereotypical stuff, yeah, um, so, in in terms of, you know, chat, gpt and text-based content, we don't really use it so much for that, but yeah, and, and you know, like, marketing content, like text, uh being uh pumped out of those chat bots now is is painfully awkward, uh and and we try to use it and we end up spending more time on tweaking the prompt than just writing in ourselves to try and get the bot to produce quality work. But where we use it is like, okay, how can we make our workflows more effective? So you know, we work largely in like Figma and Adobe suite, um and and the software that they offer.
Speaker 3:I work a lot with, for example, motion, uh graphics and after effects, animation, emotion, uh. I also have, again, with my interest and background in technology, I do a lot of simple coding, um for projects. So I use ChachiBT as a partner there. I've written you know I'll write little scripts to make my workflow easier. It can be everything from.
Speaker 3:This stupid example is when you're going to animate something, you export it from Adobe Illustrator. It's maybe an animation with like 50 layers. You export it into After Effects and you have no control of the layer order because the layer order is just super random in Illustrator and then it's super random in After Effects. Then you're suddenly going to animate all these layers and maybe you want it to go in a certain direction. So you spend time reordering all of these layers manually. And this was for a specific project where we had a bunch of kind of pixel-based illustrations. So I had chachi bt, write me a little script that said, okay, I will select the starting point in an in an illustration starting pixel, and then I want you to follow the the adjacent pixels to figure out the correct uh layer order and reshuffle everything. When I run the script into like a sequential order, did it? Yeah? And when you're producing like 30 animations based on 30 different illustrations and you have to do that job manually, versus running a script that takes a millisecond, you know we're talking about hours and hours of time saved. So things like that are amazing.
Speaker 3:And then, in terms of coding, I'm also using it to extend my knowledge. My coding background is from being an 8-year-old, 10-year-old kid in the US. I bought an HTML and CSS and JavaScript book and taught myself to code websites back in the day when I don't know if you guys had it in Norway. Geocities and AngelFire were like these places. You could make websites and it was like super nineties graphic style. But I learned how to code from that. But you know, I've I've updated my coding knowledge, of course, since then, but I'm by no means a developer, but um, but uh chat. Gpt allows me to kind of sometimes pretend that I am, or at least, uh, at least extend my, my knowledge there and and easily fix kind of low code uh solutions for for projects.
Speaker 3:So back to the, the core question I had. I don't think it's out for anyone's job in the creative industry. I think it's a partner we're going to have, um, and in terms, you know, people, like people keep telling, like I'm, I'm curious on on extending my, my coding education. You know, do I want to take some classes, brush up my javascript to to kind of be able to use it in modern, modern context, and people tell me, oh, but you know, developers, they're not going to have a job either in five years. It's not true. Who's going to continue to develop these platforms? Yeah, there's AI tools now that that can be your either co-pilot or your developer, but someone's got to make that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, um, so will it take some people's jobs? For sure, but not everybody's. And and those people who, those people who whose careers may be in jeopardy, then they'll, they'll either find something new and maybe the silver lining is, maybe they'll get more purpose. Um, you know, if it's menial jobs, uh, for a lot of people that's a job. That's just a job and not something that they enjoy and a passion. Maybe that can allow them to combine their passion with their career, like avoiding repetitive tasks and so forth.
Speaker 1:For sure, I heard that somebody described chat gpt as a highly intelligent intern. So so, yeah, they're intelligent and they're, they're good, but they're young and they don't have any experience. Yep, they double check everything they do. I think that's a great running, that's a great analogy, yeah, so so what you? What you see? The landscape in your business for the next 10 years is a long time, but what about the next five years? You also had a talk with you the other day and you said that landscape was changing in oslo because it was rough times for many, many agencies these days, and some has to sell their business yeah, yeah, it's crazy, um, you know it's funny like the design industry has survived, uh, multiple recessions and the pandemic, like for us, was like one of our busiest times.
Speaker 3:we hired people in the pandemic. Uh, this is not the case for everybody and maybe, at the end of the day, these are the pros of being a smaller uh agency is having that agility and flexibility, um, but you know, we we've we've weathered through all of that stuff and I've really kind of actually ridden the wave through that. Um, right now, you know the economy is definitely where it is. The Kroner's weak. Right now, you know the economy is definitely where it is. The kroner is weak. People are being uh losing their jobs or being uh furloughed like permit out. Um, the jobs aren't coming in anymore the way they were. We're super lucky and again back to, I think, being small. We're not feeling that we're, we're booked and busy, yeah, um, but you know, I'm I'm hearing things locally as well that that uh, it's, it's definitely slower, um, and, to be honest, I think that's just temporary Um and it's just a result of the market right now.
Speaker 3:I think that's just temporary Um and it's just a result of the market right now. Um, but I I am surprised because when, when we went through the pandemic and and didn't feel that at all it was maybe, you know, people will put things on pause for a month and then realized we're going to have to treat this as little bit surprised, even though it on our industry's market right now. But you know, when I talk to people about this they say yeah, but I think it's a little bit different, like, uh, on west london and it's it's true. In a way, you know, there is like a pillow of offshore and and moda team and oil, uh money, uh flowing through the economy here locally and here regionally, which I think offsets some of the, the pain, uh, that the market is feeling right now.
Speaker 3:um, but, yeah, just have to stay positive and I think I think things are gonna lighten up, uh, towards the end of the year and I think people are have a choice to say, oh, do we take that project this year or do we save it and put it on next year's budget? So it's going to be tough for some people. But I think what's great about our industry is we're as creators, we're creative people, we want to make stuff, so we're also able to pivot. Let's say that the market goes completely dry. We've got a thousand ideas, a thousand things we want to produce, a thousand services and ideas that we can create and get out there. So, as creative people, we're always able to adapt that creativity to new business models and new ideas. Um, so I think that's also going to be the future of of our industry. It was funny.
Speaker 3:I, I, I really like um an online publication called it's nice that they're. They cover everything from like really artsy fartsy and you call it it's nice that. Okay, yeah, um, everything from really artsy fartsy kind of creative work to to branding and and strategy. Um, and they did like kind of a trend report on on the industry and the market and one of like the recurring things is subscription-based services from design agencies and kind of like. Yeah, almost like we, we do like more package-based pricing.
Speaker 3:Um, things are moving so quickly that this old, older mentality of pricing um projects is kind of out the window. Because if we take startups as an example, like you're there one day and six months later you're, you're bust, you've gone bankrupt and funding is dried up and the brand doesn't exist anymore. So people's intentions with their investments are different and people's expectations are different as well. Like a startup might do a quick investment on branding and then, six months later, when they get the funding, do a new round on their branding. And then six months later, they've gone through maybe another series of investment and they're ready to scale up and go global. Then they rebrand again. Yeah, so it's super interesting. So that also makes us think about how we price our services and and, yeah, how we can kind of meet the client in the middle there.
Speaker 2:Um, and I think you're looking at me now because this is examples for me. I come, I always want branding from last number yeah, like I'd always afford it. So come back, but it's six months with new requests, I see like you know.
Speaker 1:So how would that work? Would you like pay a monthly fee and then you have like the branding work being done continuously over time, so you have like a long time partnership with you, for example.
Speaker 3:Yeah, people have different models. Um, we're we're not too keen on that model because you know, when you start selling hours, it really limits your growth ability, right? If you're selling an hour, to be able to sell two hours, then you need a second person and three hours a third person. So to lock in hours is really tricky. So those kind of subscription models really require the right team or outsourcing strategies, which is not necessarily something that I believe in, because you lose a little bit of the control of the, the creative quality and the output. But that's, you know, that's one, one package. But I've seen, I've seen a couple agencies doing we call brand sprint the strategy, but they call brand sprint the, the, the full delivery. They'll, for example, take a week and do everything from the strategic to the visual identity within those five days. You pay a fixed fee. Um, they have a good formula for how that's done. Yeah, and again, trust your, your gut as a, a creative. You get maybe two options to choose from and, and at the end of the week you've got a brand there. Um, I see they book in their calendars. It's almost like haircut appointments, right? Yeah, um, so, so, depending on their capacity, they've got five slots available for march and then you choose or april and you choose um, choose one of those. So there's different models and I think it's super, you know.
Speaker 3:Back to like, what helps a business disrupt is thinking different. Looking at other industries let's you know that's why, um, you know, companies like airbnb, uber have succeeded is, again, not copying the business model of their competitors, but trying to think different. Look to other industries for inspiration in terms of you know how do they do it, how do they price things, how do they deliver their services. So I think that's that's really important. Again, back to what you're asking uh managers and owners to think about in a branding process, it's really important to look at other industries for inspiration. Um, and and in terms of business model as well.
Speaker 3:You know, maurice, I have done a bit of business development work with you and you know we, we had a, a project where we talked about, you know, um, yeah, you know, physical uh workshops and and things like that as a service. The same way, you would sell software, and you know that's just thinking different, um, and and it's a different avenue of revenue and a different, yeah, disruptive way to to do things. That isn't maybe the norm and I think that's really interesting for businesses and definitely something that that everybody should kind of consider uh, both in the branding process but, of course, when they're. When they're thinking about how to pivot a business or how do you survive a downturn in the economy right now, think different. Look to other industries, see what you can do differently there.
Speaker 1:That's a good segue to the last topic, which is about starting tech companies while you're running your agency. Yeah, I mean, there are two companies, how you can say, that have done this. You have Tada, they've started the board game Superclub and you have started Runwell.
Speaker 3:Is this a trend or is it like unique for Haugesund that we have this over creative agencies wanting to do more. No, I think it's definitely it's not unique to Haugesund, it's definitely a trend and something we're seeing in the creative industry. We sit on so much competence that we give to our clients that it's it's really just a bit silly to not kind of create your own ideas. Um, you know, clients are coming to you and and they're asking you to help shape and form and develop and brand their vision and so you do that full uh run or product run from start to finish for someone else. Why not do it for yourself? And if you're business minded, that's where you get the kind of unique opportunity. So I think that's a trend that you know. We're seeing that in Oslo, we're seeing that internationally, where they're coming up with business ideas if it's a sauce uh product, a software product or physical products, like I don't know if you guys know, amik the sheets.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I got it asleep and it's. It's a design agency, is it? Yep, really, yeah, simple, simpleness. My wife heard about that on a podcast and she got sold in they.
Speaker 3:They specialize them I've specialized in in, like e-commerce and that whole brand to market yeah, um model and then said why are we not doing this for ourselves? What products are super interesting? Yeah, and the irony, you know, uh, we hired hot odds, you know my brother-in-law uh into LNA back Larson and Emerald back in 2019, maybe 2018, 19. Um, and his background is in product um development or product design, so we hired him in and he came in as a partner in the business as well. Really, his main goal was was to kind of do some of this like product development. What can we do as larson and amaryll, as, as alternative, uh, business sources and the kind of ideas can we produce? The irony with this, uh meek, is um, we had a, a sheet, uh company idea back back in the day. Yeah, it was called. It was called snort. So great minds think alike um, I like that name better.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, but that could have worked with the difference here. Of course, they have quality sheets and linen, but, uh, the difference, I think, is the branding right, and there's so much to do with the branding, because there's so many who sells high quality sheets, for sure. Why do I buy a muke is because of the branding and how to communicate and the platforms they're on, yeah, and how they talk directly to you, yeah, yeah, you see them everywhere, yeah, exactly. So I think, uh, yeah, I think you're really onto something and, and that's the thing platforms they're on, yeah, and how they talk directly to you, yeah, yeah, you see them everywhere. Yeah, exactly. So I think, yeah, I think you're really- onto something, and that's the thing.
Speaker 3:Like we're as creatives we're, we're thinking differently and we're looking at kind of a traditional business model and saying, oh, room for our room for innovation. You know, a simple thing is like uh, you know, with a lot of e-commerce things, um, or e-commerce products, like, people have started to introduce a subscription model on things that you had never thought you would have a subscription model before. But of course, everyone wants, like, again another product idea we explored back in the day, it was scented candles, and not just to do a regular old scented candle, but, um, one of the ideas there was subscription based. Yeah, why not automatically get either seasonal candles that go on the scent of the season? Or, you know, as norwegians, like one of the probably biggest consumer products at home is, tell us this uh, you know so, even tell us why. Why do you have to go to nilla every month and buy a little bag of these, uh, these candles? Yeah, so it's those simple, like little itty bitty, disruptive thoughts that can make your product succeed. Yeah, um, yeah, you know, the sky's the limit.
Speaker 1:Are you tempted to do more of that? I mean, it's also pressure on your time, I guess, because yeah, for sure.
Speaker 3:I mean, if we take Runwell as an example, that started under the pandemic as a project with Hottald and Inventum through Larsen and Amaral. We invested time applied for DipMidLid from Design and Innovation Norway, which, at DipMidLid, is a design innovation program that's what it stands for, and so they give funding to businesses to use design agencies to help them solve business challenges. Yeah, real business challenges that that business is is uh facing. So run well was one of those. Um, you know a very analog industry where everything was done on paper through text messages, emails. Uh, really a bit of a mess, um, so how can we solve, uh, the flow of of uh drift for the hospitality industry? Um, so that's where that started and you know funding from things like doge. Um, and then we got funding from innovation norway that allows you to put hodl on that object full time. Yeah, but yeah, it's, it's, it's uh evolved into a spin-off product. Um, so that's its own separate company.
Speaker 3:Larson emerald is is one of the majority owners still, um, and you know hot all then and pet that and run while they sit in our office. So there's a lot of hands-on still. We work with them. We have a an hour hour pot every month that we set aside for run. Well, that we, you know, help help keep the product and marketing and brand um move forward. Uh, so I think that's that's the way to do. It is kind of start, uh, treating things as like a mvp and and see where it goes.
Speaker 3:But once you see that it can either affect capacity or or focus, then it's time to consider, okay, do we, do we pull this out as a, as a sister company or a spinoff or or one one? Some business might want to go all in and say you know what this is, this is the future. This is more lucrative than what we're doing today. Why not do that? So, but, yeah, for us, I think that philosophy is is still there and we've we've got a couple different ideas and products in the works um, nothing I can be concrete about, but uh had as early as yes, uh, yesterday evening, a follow-up meeting with the developer on one of those cool um. So, yeah, again thinking of smart ways to work, and both for us and for our clients. And you know there's a lot of possibilities within SaaS products and there's some interesting stuff with physical products as well. So it's definitely something we want to continue, but we're still a consultancy service for our agencies.
Speaker 1:It's just super interesting to see how it develops. Yeah, we're coming to the end. Do you have any last questions, marius, or should we just go on to the lightning round?
Speaker 2:Maybe one last question is to ask you what's your favorite brands, like, what recognizes like a really good branding or a brand for you Like, maybe like to make it concrete maybe one local brand and one international brand. I don't know if you had to pick on the spot there, but that's very, very hard Someone who does maybe not your favorite, but someone who does a good job.
Speaker 3:Does a good job. I mean, right now I'm like in a bit of a baby bubble. I just had my first kid and my daughter, billy. You know you're looking at, you know filling your house with baby stuff and you know we're both visual aesthetic people but we also understand like big important part of development for kids is contrast and color and shape and form. So to find like a brand that that makes both mom and dad and baby happy is is definitely a challenge. But you know there's a danish brand, leewood um, which is really uh, really nice, really interesting. They're focused on. They have a very clear brand, very clear um aesthetic that that kind of carries their brand but they're also focused on you know, sustainability, child development, um, so I think that's a really great example of of again thinking disruptive.
Speaker 3:Like fisher price is like the go-to. Uh, produced in china. Plastic, uh, you know, press mold toys for kids, but then lee wood is making things from wood and and, uh, you know, food safe silicone and trying to produce stuff that they can in denmark. And thinking a little bit different and thinking about carrying on the tradition of danish and scandinavian design into their products for kids, without it being overly pinterest, instagram mama kind of aesthetics. So I think that's maybe a brand that I think is is interesting. Um, today, I think in terms of like a software company, figma, I think is awesome. Uh, you know, if there's somebody I look up to in the industry right now, it's the two founders and figma. They've come and just disrupted an industry Like Adobe has had a monopoly on the creative industry delivering software for like 30 years, and then these two nerds come and just create a game changing software that everybody has just adapted and dropped Adobe like overnight. It's incredible.
Speaker 1:I mean, when we were at the tech conference in San Francisco last year, the founder I don't know, I can't remember his name Dylan Field, probably, Probably and he came on the stage just in jeans and a t-shirt what no?
Speaker 2:Basically a young kid who just made a billion.
Speaker 1:And the acquisition was supposed to be 20 billion or something like this. It's like incredible amounts. It didn't go through, though in the end no adobe trying to acquire them.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it didn't go through. Yeah, the story is because of european regulations. Yeah, but I think they made a right choice. I think they would alienate their audience by by being acquired by adobe, so I think that was a smart, strategic choice um, and we could almost feel that in the audience.
Speaker 2:Right, remember, when he was supposed to be true like that, he almost got booed by the yeah he is.
Speaker 1:It wasn't a good thing. He has to do defend.
Speaker 3:You know his choices and it's tough, you know you've got it. You've got vcs and investors behind you and they're pushing you and they want a return on their investment and so this one transaction would return their whole fund right?
Speaker 1:so it's just one of those connected.
Speaker 2:This is a long conversation, but like what's happening now in Norway with S-Banken or Scania Banken and being bought up by DMB. But Scania Banken developed like a brand for people who wanted to disrupt the finance. Yeah, we quit, and a lot of customers, even Also me, I quit because I didn't want TMB to take over the brand and they didn't have Apple Pay.
Speaker 3:They didn't have Apple Pay.
Speaker 2:It's crazy, but yeah, but that's a talk for hours. Maybe go to the lightning round.
Speaker 1:Let's do it. Do you have like a book or a podcast you would recommend?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's funny, you know I got this question sentence to see. I said, yeah, all you read is morikami I. I love, uh, uh morikami japanese author. I read everything of his um, but I always tend like lately, how it got me huh, morikami, morikami.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you see the one who wrote uh region wood kofka on the shore. Um, what I talk about when I talk about running?
Speaker 3:yes, yeah, I read that, yeah he's a big runner, he's a big enthusiast yeah, so he's he's. He's an inspiration creatively, very surreal in how he writes, but very interesting. But I always lately, like I was sitting on the the beach with your buddy, um Olav, and he he was talking about something. I recommended this book, barbarian days, and I I find myself recommending it to everybody. It won a pulitzer prize, it was on obama's reading list and I do most of my reading in the summer. That's like where I deep dive into books. Uh, it stuck with me and I want to read it again, so I think I'm going to read it again this summer.
Speaker 3:It's, it's essentially it's I think it's called barbarian days, a surfer's life or something. It's a surfer, it's a writer who writes for the new yorker and new york times and all these well-established publications, and it's his, it's his life growing up, uh, moving from california to hawaii and traveling the globe, with surfing as like the theme. But it's like a deep dive into racism and culture and and globalism and and philosophy and zen and and everything. It's kind of like maybe a twist on like or, for those that have read, zen and the art of motorcycle maintenance, it's like an updated, newer version of that with surfing as the medium.
Speaker 3:So that's my book and podcast lately, I guess. Then you know I'm like a crime true crime guy, but it's all about quality there. So then I've switched over to something called 99 invisible, which is definitely more up my alley. That's like a design design podcast, but everything from product to branding and graphic design, and it's not necessarily just for designers, it's. It's like making, creating, it's really interesting stories behind all kinds of things. So that's something for anyone that wants like a little bit of yeah, outside influence from the design, uh, field.
Speaker 1:That's definitely an interesting podcast the next one is favorite tool, but I would guess figma figma is my favorite, uh favorite tool, but I would guess figma.
Speaker 3:Figma is my favorite uh work tool, like craft tool, and I would say my calendar is my favorite like productivity tool. I'm a big believer in time blocking. Yeah, that's been our success to being able to be a small company and manage a lot of projects. Um, time blocking is key focus time. So my calendar is filled with time blocks. You know we use project management tools as well to kind of get the nitty-gritty, but that calendar is super, super visual way to see this is my week, this is my day. This is how I set aside focus to to my projects do you have any um for builder?
Speaker 3:to like inspiration or like, um, heroes, the heroes, but it's tough. I'm not that kind of person, Um, but you know, we've talked about Figma, Like I talked about it last night with with this developer, like Jesus, those guys have really done something cool. So, you know, I think that's really maybe a a simple answer to that question uh, yeah, did you ever get any good advice?
Speaker 1:uh, as a founder, somebody who gave you good advice, or what would it be? Oh man yeah, I.
Speaker 3:I think the best advice is what my wife, cecilia, who's also the co-founder of larson hammer, always tells me um, you'll always succeed if you do something that you love, and I think there's a lot of truth to that. Yeah, if money is your only motivation, uh, it kind of blurs your vision. I think purpose in in what you do and back to, like ai, taking over remedial jobs and meaningless jobs. It's like we have a long life and it's filled with work, because that's how capitalism works, and we have to pay bills and own a house. Why not do something that you love and that gives you purpose and motivates you that way? And I think that's something that, yeah, you just have to remind yourself of constantly. But I really believe that and value that she has said that Great advice.
Speaker 1:It is. It really is. Could you tell us something about yourself that you don't think most of us know?
Speaker 3:I told you before we started here, but I think everybody thinks you know I'm a designer, but you know I'm a. I'm a designer, but you know my my like first love is music. Um, I've played in in a bunch of different bands.
Speaker 3:And what do you play? I play, I'm like a multi-instrumentalist. Uh, I'm most comfortable with guitar, but I play everything from drums to what doesn't this guy know I know, but guitar is definitely my, my, my vibe, um, so I, you know, I studied, um, I have a degree in audio technology, which is like engineering degree, so technical engineering, electrical engineering, meets music production and acoustics. Uh, so both the creative and the science and technical behind it. I think a lot of people don't know that and, and you know I have a super diverse taste in music. I listen to everything from, like, folk and americana to, uh, punk and screamo and jazz and af, west african, uh, you know, uh, folk music, like all over the place. So I think that kind of.
Speaker 3:Maybe those that know me really well know that that's what I'm into. But but those that don't know me think yeah, he's just a, he's a design guy, it's about the visual stuff. But music's where it started and what's cool is like I get to combine that with my job. Some of our most successful projects have combined music and or technology, and those are the projects that have won us international awards and and helped us build our portfolio and get new business. So that's always fun when I get to do those, those projects.
Speaker 1:Great yeah, thank you for for being here. It was lovely to have you. Thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3:It's been fun.
Speaker 1:Lykkesliten blir spilt inn I et professionelt podcast studio at H90 in Haugesund Center. If you want to know more about the creative work environment and work community at H90, check out h90.no. Bye.